Jamey: 0:18

Hey everyone, welcome back to Track side, the podcast for Marshals. I'm Jamey Osborne.

Jessica: 0:23

Hey, I'm Jessica Althoff.

Jamey: 0:25

And we are having the pleasure of hosting this podcast, which has uh really been a lot of fun. This has been the project of 2025 for us, and you know this podcast has come a long way. And uh we've over 500 downloads. Ooh, that's they used to measure it in terms of subscribers, they don't do that anymore. But anyway, if you're listening to this, we are glad you are here. If you're our race motorsports marshal, we uh think you'll get something out of this podcast, almost assuredly. If you're wanting to be a podcast marshal, we've got info for you too, and uh that's kind of what we do here. We've got a really great guest today lined up, but before we get to our guest and uh what Adam does, Jessica, there's been some stuff happening since we last sat down to record an episode. Uh let's start with WEC. You were at WEC and uh I was at WE World Endurance Challenge at Austin. It's their only appearance in America for 2025, and it was an eventful weekend.

Jessica: 1:37

It was. Do you want to tell everyone why you were not at WEC real quick?

Jamey: 1:41

I would this the first WEC event I have missed since I became a marshal. I have a reason, I have an excuse, and besides, my wife would have killed me had I missed had I gone to WEC instead, because I was in Egypt on race day. On uh that day, I was I was trying to figure out exactly where I was. I think we were in Luxor, Egypt, but anyway, we were in Egypt celebrating our 25th anniversary. So I got all of the reports, and my WhatsApp was blowing up like crazy. But I wouldn't I missed it. You've got to be our reporter, Jess. You've got to get us through this.

Jessica: 2:24

I don't know. Your trip sounded pretty awesome. It's definitely on my list to uh visit Egypt one of these days. So I'm glad you had a great time and uh well deserved to get to go that milestone and everything.

Jamey: 2:33

Thank you.

Jessica: 2:34

Um yeah, WEC was great. I think it went really well. Um, I was the deputy race chair with uh alongside the race chair, Sidney Davis Yeagle, who's an alum of the show. So it was really great to work with her. I feel like I learned a lot. Um, I think it went well. And uh yeah, I think it was it was good. One thing I'd love to mention is that, you know, leading up to the event, um, I was doing the if if you've marshalled before, you're probably familiar with a website called motorsportreg.com. And that's a website where we do all of our, you know, that's like a recruitment kind of tool. So you would apply if you want to be considered as a marshal for these events. And I got a uh email through that form from a young man at University of Texas in Austin here asking, you know, hey, we're part of a SAE group. If anyone's familiar with the formula SAE, I think that's what the Society of Automotive Engineers, I believe.

Jamey: 3:27

I believe so, yeah.

Jessica: 3:28

And uh asking if there was anything that they could get involved with. And um, at the time we were kind of low-ish on flaggers. And I thought, you know, I wonder if we could maybe pull some strings to get this group on a flag stand. You know, if anything, they're gonna kind of supplement our numbers and they can get a foot in the door. And so I ran it up the chain. And long story short, we got approval and um uh Lone Star Region, the local SECA region, sponsored them for memberships. We got them certified, licensed. And I think we had 18 or 19 students from UT come and be flaggers with us for WEC weekend, and uh we're so thrilled to have gotten to host them. It sounds like we got some good feedback that they had a good time. I know some of them were at SVRA this uh recently at the time of this of this recording. Um so uh it sounds like we're gonna have some some members and some more people that are getting involved with this kind of thing. So we're thrilled. So to any of the Longhorn Baja students, um, thank you for coming. And I hope you guys had a really good experience. So thank you for listening. Yes, thank you for listening. Hopefully you are.

Jamey: 4:40

So, how was the experience of being a deputy race chair?

Jessica: 4:43

It was really fun. It was kind of uh hearkening back to my music festival days. It's a lot more kind of like that type of role. It's you're kind of the if there's things going on that need to be done, you you're kind of that catch-all per I'm like I felt like I was like kind of the help desk in in race control. If anything needed to be done, it was just, you know, come to me or escalate it to me and I will I will triage it like I'm the switchboard or whatever you want to call it. Uh I really enjoyed it. I thought it was fun. I uh would definitely do more of that. So stay tuned, maybe, you know. I think uh that might be something I try again next year. We'll see. But um, it's a long ways away. I have no idea. But I would gladly be deputy racetrack again if Sydney and Coda would have me. So yeah.

Jamey: 5:27

That's really cool.

Jessica: 5:28

So that was really cool.

Jamey: 5:30

The the big news of the WEC weekend was the rainstorm that moved in. We had all kinds of weather extremes. It was a hundred degrees on a couple of the days, and then it started to rain that morning.

Jessica: 5:44

Yes, it did, unfortunately. That was that was a bummer for sure. But uh we you know it went on, the show must go on, and it did. We didn't have any uh lightning, which was a nice, you know. That's that's the thing, I think, to everyone that's not aware. That's the showstopper. We will race in the rain all day. It's the lightning is what can really throw a wrench in the machine.

Jamey: 6:03

So yeah, well, it did for SVRA this last weekend because out of nowhere, out of nowhere, we had a rainstorm, and we've been having beautiful the weather was beautiful, except for Saturday. We had these clouds and they didn't even look like rain clouds, and all of a sudden we had lightning move into the area, and I saw a flash out of the corner of my eye, and I thought, oh no, and then I looked again, and then my phone app started going off, and there it went. But the rest of the weekend was perfect, so yeah, lightning is the showstopper.

Jessica: 6:37

Yes. Well, since we're talking about SVRA, yeah, how was it overall?

Jamey: 6:41

Other than that, SVRA is good, it's one of my favorite events of the year. Um, we think of it as a pro event, but it's not really a pro event. Uh, the drivers aren't paid, I guess. Transam might be to a certain extent, but they're anyway. It's a it's a great event, it's a lot of fun. Um, it's a really approachable event because the fans can walk through the paddock, you buy a ticket, you can watch all the racing, you can walk through the paddock. It's very, very uh fan-friendly. Um I love seeing all the fabulous old cars and the guys that take a million-dollar car and put it on a racetrack when it might should be in a museum. You know, sometimes you wonder how sane they are, but uh they get out there and they do it. And the racing was generally pretty good. And um even the Transam guys behaved themselves out there. It was it was crazy, but uh uh the Trans Am Marshals kept telling us that the fastest two Transam drivers were both rookies and you know, really young kids, 15-16 years old. So you know the future of motorsports is strong and SVRA likes to show it off. It's SVRA is kind of the extremes, you know. That we didn't have F3 F4 this year, which was kind of sad, but uh we had you know the young drivers in TA and TA2, and then we had you know the sort of old guys driving old cars uh part of vintage. It's uh it was a lot of fun weekend. It it's definitely our loudest event of the year, that is for certain.

Jessica: 8:19

Yeah, yeah, that was I I was sorry to miss it, unfortunately.

Jamey: 8:22

I was out of town, but um I listening to concerts in Las Vegas. When Jessica's not at the racetrack or working, she is at a concert somewhere.

Jessica: 8:35

It's true, yeah. No, I don't have a gambling problem, even though we were there being lots of lots of lots of Vegas discussion later. This will be this was the first of three like back-to-back Vegas trips in the next three months total or whatever. So no, I was yeah, music reasons this time, but uh I was I did the Motorsport Reg stuff for it, and we got a good turnout of volunteers, so I hope it was good on that standpoint. And uh, so did they have the uh car-shaped tortilla tortilla chips, the mission chips?

Jamey: 9:06

You know what? I don't know. They didn't have them in race control, I will say that. Yeah, they normally bring a big bag of them into race control. So I'm gonna say no because usually race control gets a huge bag of those. And I was out on the start stand this year, but uh we go into race control for lunches and and uh getting out of the sun and such.

Jessica: 9:30

So I didn't see them, but uh well yeah, they usually have those big racks of these promotional so mission foods is like the I think the flagship and they're still a sponsor, yeah. Yeah, and they'd always have these like literally like motorcycle and car shaped tortilla chips in actual yes, it's a thing. You can probably Google this.

Jamey: 9:50

So yeah, and they're and I I like them, they're really good. Yeah, not a plug, they're they're not a plug, not a plug.

Jessica: 9:59

No, but anyway, so should we back up a little bit to oh yeah?

Jamey: 10:03

Runoffs, yeah. We yeah, so I got to do something really cool. I got to do the SCCA runoffs this year, and uh big thanks to Marsha Ulise, who um is the captain of the start team at the runoffs at Road America. I got to visit Road America for the first time, got to work the runoffs for the first time, and it was a really great experience. I I have to say, I wasn't sure what to expect. Um, but it was it was really neat. And uh I was a part of eight a team of eight starters, and you know that's always wild when you've gotta have that many starters, but for all the races, it's like SVRA in that there's all these classes and they all get you know qualifications and practices, and you know, then then uh a race, and you know it it takes a long time to do, it's like a nine-day event, something like that, which is why I'd never been before. But um the circumstances worked out, and um I discovered that Marsha, who I had met at the Las Vegas Grand Prix, was going to be the chief, and so I sort of had my information in, even though I found out there's a really very nice page at scca.com slash runoffs that has all that stuff. Um I took the plunge and had a great experience. Road America is a fabulous track, it's a great facility. Um, beautiful. It's almost it it ranks up there with, and I've never been there, but Barber, from what I understand, both of those facilities, the grounds are impeccable, um, easy to get around. You know, we had fortunately very good weather, um, a lot of really neat options in the area, and just a great experience. It was a lot of fun and um learned a lot and happy to have been. It was uh really good. And a number of our uh Texas area drivers did fairly well this year, and that was uh really good from the track standpoint. From the Marshall, there were far fewer Texas Marshalls than I would have expected. So, you know, that's uh something that I'll uh start to twist the gears on some of my friends, you know, to get up there. And uh another really cool thing happened while we were there, too. Yes, I'm gonna embarrass you, Jess, because um uh last year, part of the reason I went and and everybody was giving me grief about it was that last year I was named starter of the year and you know, worker of the year in the starter category, and I wasn't there, you know, not pictured as it is how it always appears in the press release. So I kind of felt guilted to go up there this year. So I went up this year, and at the worker of the year presentation that that night after they fed us, they got up to start doing things, and I look over and Nadja Pollard's sitting at the table right across from me, and she's very happy to see me. And she waved and she texted me, Jessica's getting award, you have to go accept it. I was like, oh, and so in the race administrator category this year, Jessica Altoff was our worker of the year for the SCCA. So congratulations, Jess. It was my pleasure to get the award. I finally gave it to you at F1, the US Grand Prix.

Jessica: 13:33

I'm thrilled for it to have been you, to have accepted it. And hopefully, you you know you got your sort of moment to be up there from the Yeah, I don't care about that at all.

Jamey: 13:42

It was just it was just really great for me. And uh when not just said you've got to get the getter award, I was like, Oh, I'm happy to do that. So very cool.

Jessica: 13:51

That was cool, very unexpected. So I'll I have to tell you, so I was in the UK at the time. Listening to concerts, going to shows, British bands, and no one's ever heard of. I won't get into that, no one cares. But anyway, I uh woke up at like 9 a.m., which was like 3 a.m. your time or whatever, and I just see this. My phone is just blown up with texts of congrat congratulations with zero context when not a word about why. And I'm like, what in the hell is going on? And of course, you know, everyone's it's three in the morning, no one's gonna answer right now. So I was on pins and needles for hours, like, what in the hell? And so it was revealed.

Jamey: 14:34

And that was my fault.

Jessica: 14:35

That no, uh you and Nadja, I think.

Jamey: 14:38

I I orchestra, well, I put the idea in Nadja's head because that's what happened to me is I'm not at runoffs. In fact, I think I was watching a football game, and or you know, I was watching television doing something, and I got this text from a number I didn't recognize saying, Congratulations, and then another one, and then another one, and then one whose number I did recognize, and I was like, What is all this going on? I thought it was being pranked, and so you know it was kind of funny, and and I didn't learn until the next day what what had happened and what what it meant. So I was like, We're gonna let Jessica do the exact same, have the exact same experience I had. So we're gonna give her a whole bunch of context list, and you just have more friends to to blow you up. I had five or six, and you had a lot more than that.

Jessica: 15:28

I was maybe a dozen or so, but it was very it was very nice, and it was very, very unexpected. I never in a million years dreamed that that was gonna happen. So thank you for the shout-out with that. And you said that you felt guilted into going this year, and I've already been I've already been guilted that I need to go next year.

Jamey: 15:47

There you go. You do, you do, and it will be at Road America in the first weeks of October.

Jessica: 15:53

And I've heard I still have not been there, and I've heard it is like a sight to be seen, and it's a it's everyone's fave, and so I'm looking forward to yeah. So yeah, I think I need to do it. I I I think we've mentioned before, I'm uh I got hoodwinked as I joke um about joining the SIT program with the SECA, the steward in training. And so I've been told that that's a really good um kind of boot camp, if you will, uh for that, because you can kind of do uh describe it as a flight. It's like a little of every role as a steward. So you can do kind of each one each day. So yes, I have penciled it in. As long as there's no shows. I mean, if Suede is playing, then heaven help you.

Jamey: 16:36

Nothing competes with Suede.

Jessica: 16:38

Yeah, yeah, but no.

Jamey: 16:39

Although I I do like to point out that Suede played the Singapore Grand Prix last year or a couple years ago.

Jessica: 16:46

Yeah, it was I think it was the year before last or something, and it was just it was slightly too last minute, and I was like, ah, dang it, I should have the Marshall application had long been closed by then. I was like, ah well.

Jamey: 16:57

Well, speaking of Grand Prix, that's our last thing to tick the box on recapping uh since our last uh recording is the US Grand Prix in Austin. How did that go for you?

Jessica: 17:08

It was great. I had a really good time. Um, I worked uh I think I was thinking about it, and I think this was my I don't know, seventh or eighth US GP, as we call it in Austin. Um, and I think I've done something different at every single one of them.

Adam: 17:24

I think so.

Jessica: 17:25

I think so. And uh as much as I absolutely loved last year, which I got to be a starter there, which was awesome, and I look forward to doing more of that, of course. We'll talk about later. Um, I was back in the room this year. I was uh race control communicator for the PPG team. As you probably, if you've listened to our most recent episode, you'll know that's uh the PitPedic grid. So that's uh Nadja Polly.

Jamey: 17:49

And they were on our last episode screens of PPG, Nadja Pollard and Tony Burke.

Jessica: 17:55

So I uh got to be one of their communicators along with Daniel Meathum, who uh was new to the team as well, and uh he's gonna be doing more of that, I believe, with them. So yeah, we got to do that and uh had a great time. We got some really nice feedback. I think it went really well. Um, we had an interesting thing happen, and I think you might have seen this channel.

Jamey: 18:16

I think a lot of people saw it. It was um one of those weird things from an F1 event that actually makes news the day after and in the full week after because it was a thing. And uh tell us about what happened because you were you had literally a front row seat to it.

Jessica: 18:37

Yeah, we had a bit of involvement. So I think it was the the night of the event. Uh news started circulating, of course, gradually, like it does. And the the the big thing was that Red Bull got fined for uh one of their crew members re-entering the grid um once the formation lap had started. And so uh I can tell you that you know, we were in there, and let me just back up for a second. So, you know, we got the formation lap, everybody's gridded up to depart for their formation lap. We have all the people on the grid, you know, we start clearing that, and then we have these giant gates. And if you listen to our previous episode, you'll know you'll hear us talk about these gates. They're massive, they're hundreds of games.

Jamey: 19:16

They're big enough to push a Formula One car through.

Jessica: 19:19

They're huge and they're very heavy, and it takes about four people to properly close a gate, and there's lots of components that go into it. So you gotta close the gate, you gotta secure them with these metal bars and then pieces of arm co and this and that. So it's a whole production. So and the reason for that is is purely safety, right? So if something, you know, when they're coming back around and a car blows up or hits the wall, you know, we need gaps in that wall to be able to move in and out. But you know, when when the track is hot, we have to have those closed. So that's kind of what those gates come in. And so we must make sure that they're fully secured for safety reasons. Well, what happened was when everyone was clearing the grid, um our team at gate one was attempting to close the gate and they could not do so because that crew member had run back out there to do something, which at the first articles didn't really specify what had happened. Essentially, they were saying he got fined because he re-entered the grid. And so it was later revealed kind of what happened, which was that uh the McLaren team had put a piece of duct tape or gaff tape or whatever on the wall to mark his spot because it's it's hard for them to say, you know, know when to stop when they're gridding. Uh it is not illegal to put tape out, and it is not illegal to remove the tape, but that's what Red Bull was doing. This is all public information. There's nothing I'm I'm not blowing any of anything by telling you. Yeah, so the Red Bull team member went out there to remove the tape to from Lando to, you know, just to, you know.

Jamey: 20:52

To mess with him.

Jessica: 20:53

To mess with him, to be a jerk, whatever you want to, whatever you want to say. And um, so that putting the tape there, there's nothing wrong with that. Removing the tape, there's nothing wrong with that. The issue is that he re-entered the grid when he wasn't supposed to. And that's what the fine was for. And just from our perspective, you know, we're very Marshall-centric in the show, and I can tell you that anyone that puts our marshals in a position that, you know, compromises their safety, that's just not it's not okay. And so I just want to kind of say that, you know, I don't know who listens to this or whatever, but you know, that's the kind of thing that I don't think I don't know what happened with that the guy that did it, but he didn't seem like he was thinking about anyone other than, you know, whatever he was told to do or whatever he thought he was doing, you know. But he was he had he was preventing them from being able to, you know, safely secure that gate. That could have been not a good thing because they were coming back around.

Jamey: 21:49

Well, I happen to know some details about how bad it almost got, and I don't want to talk about them here, but it it could have been a lot worse, I have been told. Um, fortunately it wasn't. Everything, you know, the the gates got closed, the cars came to the grid, we started the race, life goes on. But you're right, Jess. Um I I think my takeaway is that there was uh some things that happen from the the F1 people, you know, be it a team or or what have you, um, and they're doing things you know for their F1 standings and their ratings and their you know competitiveness, but they don't realize that they're putting other people, other marshals, and in danger and having consequences that they're not anticipating. And you know, that's you're right, that's not cool.

Jessica: 22:49

Yeah, you know, and I almost would have been more forgiving had it been like he left a tool out there, like something that it might have caused a red flag, but just to do or something that would have been unsafe once the race started.

Jamey: 23:03

Absolutely.

Jessica: 23:04

Yeah, but I mean, I'll be perfectly honest with you that the crew member that in question here should be so grateful for our stellar marshals that noticed him because the way he had his hand, had they closed the gate, it probably would have cut his fingers off because of how strong those gates are and how you know, yeah. So they really are just it goes to show what a stellar team we have. You know, they they were impeded from doing their job, they were finally able to do it, and they did it with, you know, it all went off without a hitch, but just you know, anyone that's these are those things that you know you think about all everyone loves all the drama and the news about this kind of stuff, but I don't think anyone thinks about you know what those marshals, the stress that they they were that was put on them in that moment of like they had a job to do and they were not able to do it because of a team politics, whatever you want to call it.

Jamey: 23:52

And I'm just gonna say we're neutral here, we're not right, you know, we're race officials and whatever, but just the fact that I think we report on what we observe, and we both observe that. And while I didn't observe it because I'm at the finish line a quarter mile away, but you know, my son who was standing there in the start box next to Chris Mullen who pushes the button for the lights, you know, he he saw the FIA representative getting very upset because they can't start the race with that gate open. And you know, things were very tense all the way around. So yeah, yeah.

Jessica: 24:31

And we had where I was sitting, you know, we have cameras on all that because it's our job, you know, and the clerks, of course, everyone to make sure that that gate is closed. And so, of course, when that was happening, it was just like, oh my god, why is it why why aren't they closing that gate? That was the first thing, sure, and then of course, so that's kind of where I got involved with. I had to obtain we had to obtain more information, Daniel and I of kind of okay, what what just happened here? Because and so then they had to go and kind of report on that.

Jamey: 24:58

Then it goes up the chain, it does.

Jessica: 25:00

So, anyway, kudos to the Marshall team. Uh, I don't do we want to call this gate gate? Are we calling are we are we naming it? Um, I don't know. I no, that's stupid, but I mean it's a done issue. There's no gate above. It's over now, but it's over now. But yeah, I'm just glad everyone was okay in that. And so they didn't.

Jamey: 25:18

I'm real proud of my team. We had a really good event. Um, you know, starting an F1 event is kind of a you know, well, we've talked about it before on the podcast. It's uh it it is the best seat in the house. I'm just gonna give you a little piece of uh foreshadowing on tonight's uh on on our guest today on this episode because he talks about having the best seat in the house. He has the second best seat in the house. Um, but uh my my team, I gotta, I gotta mention the story of of Nate Vincent. So one of the people I invited to my team this uh event for the US Grand Prix is a young man by the name of Nate Vincent. And Nate is the chief starter at Hallett Motors Motor Raceway or Motor Hallett Hallett Raceway up in Oklahoma. If you've ever been there, it's a fabulous little track. Um, I've been up there several times. Uh I've had the good fortune with working with Nate for uh Cvar, which is the vintage group in our area, and uh some other stuff, and lately through the SCCA. Up and coming young starter, really great kid, very soft-spoken. And uh I've started doing this thing with the starters where I I'm trying to get more young SCCA type starters involved. And when I started this program, Nate was the the person I had in mind, and so we you know, I invited him back in February or so, and and I um uh he was you know, he accepted and you know, was he he called me on an unrelated thing about a month before the event, and I and I thought as I picked up the phone, if Nate's calling to cancel, I'm gonna kill the kid, but he didn't anyway. But um, anyway, he was able to come down and and just had he he's uh he's a funny kid, he's got this poker face, you know, he's so hard to read. We were like, Nate, you enjoying yourself? You having a good time? You you know, glad you're here, and that kind of thing. And he would always answer in the affirmative, but you could never read it off of his face, you know. And um anyway, so later I got a really nice note from him in a in a couple of days after the race, about a week after the race, he texts our group. We always have a little text group for my four starters, the smallest team on the F1 grid. Uh, so we can do it through a text group. And uh he texts the uh the group um, you know, a couple weeks after the race, and he said, look what was in my local newspaper. And uh somebody had talked to the editor and told them the story about how Nate was uh starter for the Formula One down in Austin, and there was a picture, the one of the pictures we had taken of the team, and um you know the story about how he had worked at Hallett and got invited to work at the uh F1 event and had gone down and actually gotten to wave the checker flag because that was his role for the Grand Prix. And so that was really cool. That's that's exactly what this whole thing is supposed to be about.

Jessica: 28:26

Yeah, oh yeah, that worked out really share that with me. I'd love to read that. That's very, very cool. He's he's very nice. I got to meet him at ECR uh a few months ago. Yeah, very nice. That's awesome. I fully support that rotation you've got going on with bringing in people. I mean, it is like you've said, it's such a tiny team, it's such a wait list of people.

Jamey: 28:46

Oh, yeah.

Jessica: 28:47

I think it's awesome to get to do that because you know, um, our guest kind of talks about this a little bit too. And we'll get to him in just a second. Um, but you know, there's there's people that just come back again and again again, which is amazing. And I think that's awesome that we have people that, you know, low turnover. Of course, you want that. You want people having a good experience and being good at what you do, but at the same time, how do you ever get new people in if there's no openings? And so I think there's kind of that balance of like, you know, and I know Naj and Tony, I think, talked about this as well. You know, so I think it's very cool that you know, you kind of got that going on with bringing in, you know, cycling through people to at least get it to do it. Like like last year I got to do it, and it was just like, I'm just to get to do this one time was just all right, it's all yeah, and you'll do it again pretty easily. I will, but you know, I told you as a the fact that I got to do this once, I can I can die having now. So but um should we should we introduce our guests?

Jamey: 29:42

Absolutely.

Jessica: 29:43

Yeah, so we got Adam Gavala, and he is the chief of scrutineering for the three Grand Prix, the F1s in the United States, among other things. Moto GP. Um, he does talk, he was off for WEC this year because he uh he's a a new dad, so he'll talk about that briefly. So um but anyway, but he does lots of other uh FIA stuff, scrutineering, but he's gonna go on with scrutineering because I certainly didn't know anything about it hardly at all. I don't know how much you knew of Jamie, but um that was a really good deep dive, especially for someone like me. I've never considered it.

Jamey: 30:20

I I love learning about all these you're not a gearhead or or as John Biddy would say a petrol head.

Jessica: 30:26

Yes that's the thing is like I always want to learn all these things but at the same time that's the one that's always scared me because I know nothing about cars. And I remember especially in the SECA world learning with some of the stewarding stuff is you kind of mentioned it later that the the the engine breakdowns if they find something wrong with it. I mean for me to look at an engine and know oh that's illegal that part's legal there's no way I would know. Well there's no way I would I'm the same way I have to admit so that's kind of why it was never really on my radar but um he definitely talks about it as very accessible to even the non-gearheads so that's that was nice to know. So maybe someday I might have to take a shot with that.

Jamey: 31:07

But yeah you're running out of things to do in the world so you'll have to uh get creative next to go round.

Jessica: 31:13

Maybe but um no it was really nice speaking with him so it's very cool of him to come and join us. But uh yeah shall we uh take a listen?

Jamey: 31:21

Yeah without further ado this is Adam our interview with Adam Gavalla who's the uh longtime chief of scrutineering one of the things we enjoy doing on the podcast is talking to the really cool people that make race events work. And uh today we'll continue our exploration of all things pit lane with uh a very interesting person who you might occasionally see but only if you are a pit lane worker or you just happen to be kind of a marshal that's in the right place at the right time close to pit lane because our guest today is the King of Scrutineering. Now scrutineering is one of them fancy words for some really interesting people and uh I think besides our start they are probably the smallest team in the F1 paddock and uh the F1 WEC and many other specialties uh chief of scrutineering is Adam Gavala and he joins us on the podcast and uh Adam great to have you in the podcast. Yeah thanks for having me we are probably one of the smartest smallest groups yeah it's kind of funny when you think about it because uh you know my group is four so I'm always gonna win that award but uh you're structured in a way where it's basically just like one per car, right?

Adam: 32:57

Generally for for Formula One. So every every series things can be slightly different but generally it's one per car.

Jamey: 33:03

So that's really neat. So before we get into all the crazy details of what scrutinings are all about we always start by asking our guests how did they get into the scrutineering world? What was your origin story?

Adam: 33:19

I'd like to tell you that I'm a engineer and I spent many years crawling my way up but the reality is it was dumb luck. I think it was I believe it was 2013 right because the first F1 was 2012. So first Moto GP, I have a friend who I used to race go-karts with and he was a tire scrutineer for the Moto GP uh group. So uh Suzanne Royce at the time was the chief they had a last minute cancellation he gives me a call and said hey you'd love this give this woman a call so I did um at that point my motorsports involvement was mostly volunteering at Laguna Seca which is basically home track 20 minutes from where I live um so I'd been around motorsports I'd been on the pit lane I you know I understood the environment but I hadn't done any marshalling at that point so uh she said well we need somebody I'll give you a try if you don't screw up we'll see what happens that's that's how all those first conversations go right if you don't screw up maybe we'll talk you don't die you don't embarrass me we'll see where we go and that's kind of what happens I uh did that I was the first time I stepped out on the pit lane at Coda and it was you know a brand new track I was in awe I was like wow I've I've come to someplace impressive and someplace amazing because Laguna Seca the you know the old adage is uh first world track third world facilities now that was a while ago and they have gotten better but you know compared to coda yeah and a lot of these other tracks yes definitely that still holds true so um yeah that was that was the start and I was kind of hooked kind of right right from the get go and I found out she did F1 and and I was you know back then Formula One wasn't as big in the states so uh I definitely kept raising my hand you know whenever an F1 position comes open let me know but I I I did every event that I had spare vacation time to do. So it was WEC um then Formula E. I'm trying to think what else at the time I think that was it really at the time we weren't doing quite as many races as we do now. So it took me a couple years but then I got moved up into the onto the F1 crew and uh I've been hanging on ever since. So um what do you mean hanging on? You are you are running the show now yeah I just I drew the short straw I guess that's how I was you're the sucker we say that a lot you're the sucker really so you went straight to scrutineering like you know you did not do flagging any anything like that before or no no I did not which um so I did it with Suzanne my first I think after my third event with Suzanne I said hey let me go check this thing out at the regional level I feel like I need to get some of that experience under my belt so I started I did about a season with uh the folks at Laguna yeah CCA you know regionals and stuff like that and uh it was fun but once you taste the big time you know it's kind of hard to go back so um I I didn't do that as much so and actually I thought it was interesting because there was definitely um different camps so the folks that do the regional work I often found like I'd say hey do you want to come do this one of the national races and a lot of them just didn't want to like it was their club it was their fishing it was their pond and that's where they're comfortable.

Jessica: 36:34

Yeah and I was really surprised at that I thought it would I didn't realize that would be the case but yeah yeah it is very different and I was hoping it I don't mean to jump too far ahead but I would love to kind of hear the differences between since you have done both you know the SECA club level stuff versus F1 because I'm sure it's quite different. Just we'd love to hear kind of an overview of what you guys actually do. And I don't know if you want to start with club or F1 or whatever.

Adam: 36:59

I'll start because I'm more familiar with F1 and and and the major nationals. I'll also break it down by series because each series is uses us slightly differently um Formula One because that's the one everybody seems to be interested now. We are uh we observe what is happening uh to the vehicle we don't care about what the drivers are doing as much we don't care about a lot of the ancillary stuff our job is to be the eyes the ears of the the FIA so we report to uh Joe Bauer is the technical delegate for Formula One. So he is the FIA you know chief police officer and then there's a whole slew of people underneath him that we interact with pretty regularly um we always start our weekends with a briefing with him and there's a dossier they hand out which gives us a description of all the things they they want us to to be doing and and really it comes down to documenting the work that takes place. Practice sessions are wide open they can essentially do whatever they want but as the weekend ramps up and the sessions start to change then the restrictions start to come down. Normally for most people when you hear the word park for May or impound um you're not supposed to touch a car. Simple as that just don't touch it. These cars are too sophisticated not to be touched um they they're essentially on life support when they're not you know on track. So there's a long list of things that they're allowed to do. You know they're they need to connect the the fuel chillers to make sure that the fuel is kept at the right temperature when it's not running you know they have they're constantly taking samples of oil and certain things. It comes down to what are they not allowed to do and in normally once once they qualify, once they roll past uh pit out that that white line they're in part for me conditions and that's when the restrictions start to ramp up so they're not supposed to be touching aerodynamic elements except for certain ones that they're allowed to touch. And then there's not you know no suspension changes. So you have to be familiar with what parts of the car are are responsible for that. In Formula One it's um it's gotten better I guess in the last see what was the last major rule change was 2016 I think when they when they when the suspension elements became normal suspension elements that that most of us would be familiar with who are familiar with cars. Before that, you know you're you could have an actuator that's like buried you know somewhere halfway up the car. You're like how's that tied to the suspension? But it is but your job is to like figure that out and learn that one of the cool things about the job is even if you don't know you get to ask and it's their job to tell you like they're not allowed to not tell you what what they're doing. So if if you get confused or if you get lost you just inquire and because you're logging in it you know you're logging everything down and there's a big brother camera watching above you know if they give you some kind of a BS answer or something like that, well you have a timestamp and you can go back and you know dig deeper into what that's all about. So um that's the essence of Formula One. In the old uh let's see we have to back up when I first started uh we also were responsible for doing um the compliance checks on the vehicles well I'll back up even further when I uh we actually did safety checks prior to the race weekend so we started on Thursday and you'd go to every single car because the cars are essentially assembled every weekend and you know they might be bringing new parts you have different templates to make sure that the openings are adequate, that the belts are correct, you check the fire extinguisher systems, all those kinds of things. That's typical of most series. That went away I can't even remember now if several years ago and they went to a self-declaration where they declare that the car is safe and if there's a problem then it's on them. So I mean that that hurt us a little bit because it took one day away from the work that we used to do. And it was it was fun because it gave everybody a chance to see all the different cars and get to know the teams a little bit but it is what it is. Then we also something that my favorite position was to work on the scales crew. And so we after a race the cars come into the park from A area and every car gets rolled up on the scale pad which back then was the coolest thing on the world in the world in my mind. But then we descend on it with all these little templates to check to make sure all the dimensions are are within tolerance of what's allowed. That has been replaced I guess this is now the second year maybe third year has been replaced by a laser uh and somebody running you know a laptop so there's like two guys that that do it and um that's a bummer because that was that was such an exciting part because we checked every car. And so you're just cranking through the entire field you got one group one group of us and usually pit and grid would help a little bit like shuffling the cars over getting them on the scales getting them off checking them all that good stuff. Again now it's down to they only check usually three after a session. So one of the differences we could check all the car we could check the entire field in maybe an hour an hour and a half um and you don't get maybe the tolerances that you do with the laser beam but the laser beam takes a lot longer so they get only three cars in a time frame of when we would get you know half the field or something like that.

Jessica: 42:04

A laser can weigh a car is what you're saying.

Adam: 42:08

Well no it's uh they call it legality volumes so they take the cab design right that the computer has and it's essentially what they're doing is they're comparing what was submitted to what is actually there. So the laser beam reads every corner develops a 3D map of it and then they can compare that to what was submitted to see if that you're actually running what it is. So that's kind of that's the essence of it. It's actually a kind of cool video they did of uh what scrutineers do I'll see if I can send that to you if you need a follow up yeah so the laser beam has replaced I think it was about six people we had for the scales crew so that was a bummer. And then um it got more painful was it maybe three years ago now when they did away with tire scanning. So after every pit stop the the one scrutineer in each garage would have to run over and scan all the tires to make sure that they're the the right tires. That's been replaced by the tire pressure sensors, the TPS sensors.

Jessica: 43:05

So now that can all be done somewhat remotely too so the job was way more exciting when I started but you're really selling it here but I'm sorry the best part is you can't get a better ticket.

Adam: 43:21

That's that's very not you can but that's okay we'll argue that later okay well I think you can get a better ticket if you're into the cars. So there you go. Good answer.

Jessica: 43:31

Yeah so that's well maybe you're you are selling it to be more this is more fun to do at a club level with the where they still have to do everything, right? So maybe that's a good thing. Before we move on to the club level stuff, you know you mentioned earlier you know parked for mini impound where we have to you know hands off. So when they go out for you know we're getting ready for a race and they come around for their starting lap to come to the grid for all the festivities and fanfare what's the kind of the limit you know are there limitations there because obviously we all know that they have a whole crew bringing these giant carts of tires and tools and this and that. So I guess is there I and I know you guys are out there kind of watching. So I guess is there any restrictions of things you're have to be looking for like what can they do and what can't they do when they're on the grid?

Adam: 44:17

It's kind of the same restrictions that they have in the garage that's why they bring the garage with them to the pit lane. So um they they are allowed to do repairs but they have to get approval for them. So when that happens usually the the scrutiny will get a a form that says okay this is what's allowed and they can make sure they have to watch to make sure that they don't go out of bounds of whatever that approval is on the grid that gets a little more phonetic because it's usually done just through radio calls. So if I will say yes or no like they'll submit their electronic approval request and then we'll hear whether or not it you get a go and that that creates a little bit of chaos. It doesn't happen too often it did happen at the last race where they changed the rear wing on the I think it was RB and actually I had to carry the rear wing off the off the grid. That was fun.

Jamey: 44:58

Oh that was you oh that was me oh man I remember I remember an instance a couple of years back because the video of it is some uh somewhat famous on the internet at least in our racing circles about how Max I think it was hit the wall on the formation lap and they had to rebuild the car in the 12 minutes or you know in a in the hour that uh the grid took and um yeah those those kinds of things are pretty amazing to watch and they're never quite that dramatic but uh yeah you can do a lot of amazing work outside of the garage if push comes to shove.

Adam: 45:40

One of the things too on the grid is as you're uh as the time winds down so I think it's the 10 minute board they got to get all their pressure checks done so the tire pressure there's a minimum tire pressure they have to start with so all the scrutineers have to be there to record what those are um at the five minute board all the wheels have to be fitted uh and everything disconnected that's when you're you're setting the car free so kind of at the five minute board like they really shouldn't there should be nobody really touching it I think they're allowed what eight people at that point or six people left in place so um but yeah while you're on the grid they can they can do everything that they could normally do which isn't a a lot it's not a terrible lot um to see uh you know you're gonna change drinks bottles out they're gonna you know I'm trying to think things off the top of my head they have their little leaf blowers and stuff don't they should kind of cool things down yeah yeah so and you know that's kind of kind of it I guess yeah but then during the race you guys have to watch pit stops and stuff right or no you don't have to necessarily no everybody observes them but you don't have other than observe them you there's not much to do for the screen here it's really if they come in and do stuff on the car. But at that point, you know once the green flag goes park for me is lifted unless there's a red flag situation. So then that's kind of a mini park for me. So a lot not all the park for me rules are in effect but not a lot of them are so we actually have a cheat sheet like they call it we call it the headless chicken mode when the red flag comes out we just pull out the red it's like if it's not on the headless chicken list you're not supposed to be doing it.

Jamey: 47:08

So yeah wow I've always been amazed that the FIA allows work to be done on a car under a red flag because to me it would seem I don't know non-competitive or anti-competitive to be able to do that but you know there's plenty of incidents where a trashed car will get a red flag save.

Adam: 47:31

I think it's about keeping the show going so like you can do you know you have to do you can only make repairs to legitimate crash damage and I obviously that's somewhat subjective and that's you know you just screeners have to kind of like okay where's the actual damage and make sure you're not working if it's at the front they better not be making changes to aerodynamic components at the back of the car kind of thing.

Jessica: 47:50

So but um yeah it's really what it is your you're your your big brother you know over yeah watching everything yeah so that kind of maybe leads to wec um and you know that's obviously an endurance it's you a lot going on there and I know that you have your pit observer kind of subset of your team for that. Yeah and I was hoping maybe you could talk about that because I think Jamie did you ever work pit lane for Krivenic?

Jamey: 48:16

No I was always on the start team but I watched them very closely because it was really cool. I thought they had a really interesting set of rules.

Jessica: 48:24

That was so I was pit lane years ago for Krivenic and we were kind of de facto scrutiniers in the sense that we had our little reports and we'd have to watch the pit stops and look for things. And so that's kind of the only little brief foray I've made into it and I'm not saying that I was a scrutineer but I was wondering if it's the same kind of thing with WEC where are you it's you guys are are you busier you're having to watch those pit stops and look for stuff.

Adam: 48:48

Yeah so in WEC technically we only have like seven scrutineers everybody else is a pit observer it's it's by far the biggest team that we have to bring and it overlaps I think very heavily with pit and grid. So over the years like last year we're trying to kind of maybe merge the two groups a little bit more because there's so much overlap in what it is because you you're really a pit lane marshal watching for infractions of the rules related to pit stops like one thing I always like about WEC is when you watch the pit stop there's a rhythm and you learn to you learn to watch and develop that rhythm like you know the car has to come in the the it has to be powered off it has to be on the ground you know has these things have to happen in a certain order. There's only four guys allowed across at a certain time and you know you know they have to have a certain air you know wristband. So you kind of you know you learn to see that flow and if something is off in that flow then you'll know quickly like okay they did this or they did that and you know that's when you call in a penalty. They've they've changed it over the last couple of years actually they used to make us fill out forms and then you'd have to submit the form. Now they just want a radio call and they want you to take a picture. So that is one of the big differences between the series is whether or not they want you to photograph the incident or they want you to not touch your camera. F1 don't don't go near your camera just pretend it doesn't exist. It's kind of a different thing that you know for for scrutineers that's like you know sacrilege you're not allowed to touch your camera and that's no no one does that. So but yeah for so pit observers and an actual scrutineering um for WEC they do the same kind of thing they do initial safety checks and they also do uh more compliance checks in WEC so they're actually checking ride heights and stuff before a race and after a race so they have to go through the scales area um and then they also do 3D scanning and we actually help with that one where our guys will run around and put all the their 3D scanning system slightly different and they have all these little tags that have to be put on the car to help align the laser system. So like the actual scrutineers get to do that. And we are back up to the RFID tire system that WEC uses. So there's usually uh four to six guys running up and down pit lane. So if the RFID system doesn't pick up the tires when the car rolls through pit out when it comes back in they have to run and try and get the tires. And the reason it doesn't work as well in the US is uh they're required to use a different frequency. In the US that's not as reliable. So I I guess in Europe that's not that big of a deal but for us it's a pain. Yeah interesting so you're get you get to be more of a narc though when you're working endurance race where you get a watch and squeal on them if they do something they're not supposed to actually what was funny uh my one my first WEC I worked uh I was with I think it was um what was the tequila company Patronus I think had a car and they actually were running um IMSA that weekend which is where they normally ran it was the first time they decided to run WEC so they split their two cars and did one in each series and remember like they they were not prepared for WEC they didn't even understand the rules I even said hey here's my list of things I'm looking for will this help you know what it is you need to do and they're like that's awesome thank you at one point I'm like you guys are actually allowed an extra person to help you with the car and they're like we don't have an extra person so and they on they ended up doing really well that weekend too I think they finished third or something like that.

Jamey: 52:12

But yeah that was funny and then and then there's the Formula E craziness that is unlike everything else.

Adam: 52:22

Yeah that's very different. Well I shouldn't say it's very different it's similar I think it's probably similar in alignment to WEC in terms of what you're doing. And it's also there's also two crews there's a scales crew um and they're similar to what we used to do in Formula One where they're the cars are rolling in and they're doing a bunch of checks it's usually like camber checks uh they have to check um air composition of the tires what's exciting about formula e is that they do this during qualifying so there's actually that there's a there's an incredible rhythm and speed to which you have to you have like I think 90 seconds to check the car before you got to roll it out because the next one's coming in and like 10 seconds after that. Wow. So that that one is a lot I I like that a lot. It's actually you know brings back some of the energy that you used to get you know working scales in Formula One. So um you know the cars are coming in out very quickly because they do uh shootout system I'm not sure if you're familiar with Formula E's qualifying session but yeah it keeps you very busy it's a pretty pretty intense uh you know hour hour and a half or something like that and uh you gotta have guys who are quick yeah the uh Carlos who Carlos Fuenes who was their technical delegate for a long time who's who's doesn't come to the races anymore he's semi-retired but uh yeah he always had this uh clap sound so like as soon as the car's done he claps and you gotta get that thing off get ready for the next one so uh and then the guys in the garages they're more like uh WEC observers so their list their list isn't as comprehensive as um wec because they're not fewer moving parts much yeah fewer moving parts there's no real pit stop uh so yeah but that's it the one that actually we like and I know this isn't quite in the realm but it's Moto GP I was about to ask if you did Moto GP Moto GP is in is for a lot of scrutinizers I think become like um their favorite event to work because we are still more actively involved. It's obviously two less wheels um but the uh we we were actually doing the weighing we're actually doing some of the checks where you know in Formula One you're just observing and reporting and in in Moto GP we're actually doing and and and part of it. And when the car when a bike comes to down bikes after it's crashed you know you do a quick inspection check and there's a threshold of what you you know think things are and you can actually you know this is too damaged we're pulling their tech sticker. So that's that that's that's kind of exciting. And then and then and they they trust us with a lot to to do a lot of things. They're like you guys know what you're doing just make it happen. Actually we had um this is a side but uh Charlie King who's one of the URTA is the technical group because Moto GP is a little bit different where it's like a third party that does their technical stuff. He um he actually worked with us at Miami as a scrutineer mainly to kind of see the differences between uh the two series and I warned him ahead of time I said the only difference in F1 and Moto GP is an extra set of wheels and a whole lot more money.

Jessica: 55:20

Not for you as a scrutineer.

Adam: 55:22

Yeah no not for us as scrutineer you're getting a downgrade when you your compensation but yeah and we'll say the other thing the other reason we like Moto GP better is that uh they have better tabards.

Jamey: 55:31

Yes they do they really do I've always I've always found that and then wecks are kind of in between.

Adam: 55:37

Yeah and we don't have to wear the crazier wristbands you're like why are these whatever I'm already wearing ugly tabard what else do you need to embarrass me with something that's awesome.

Jamey: 55:50

So maybe we can segue over to to to the club area the club racing or just you know minor league racing whatever you want to call it just because yes you do get to do just about everything there still right now didn't I didn't I see you at runoffs Adam uh maybe at Laguna's runoffs when we were at Laguna I I'm I'm getting you mixed up then because I was my brain is sinking I what uh saw you walking around at Road America this last couple of months ago or weeks ago.

Adam: 56:21

Was not I but I used to do Formula Four in FR for a while I did that I did that from 2015 to just a couple years ago so um that actually falls in that it's funny to watch the progression. So talking about the pros one of the nice things about the pros is generally speaking and while occasionally things are caught there's such a high level professionalism and there's such a um you know detriment to doing something not good you know money mainly loss of lots of money um the the they they kind of play in bounds fair fairly well like you you're you know you you're still watching and still make looking but for the most part they don't try and push the the bounds as much and if they do they're probably doing it in a way that we wouldn't be able to observe anyway right right as you move down the ladder that goes away pushing the bounds when especially as there's less and less to to be lost you know when you get to the amateurs oh yeah it it's it's all over the place like there's nothing to lose because it's an amateur race so it's all about just pride and ego and that so all bets are off. We are going to do everything and anything that we can so in some ways you know when you're working the the the amateur stuff you're you'll get to see a lot more and you're gonna have to really really um you know work at you know not being busy trying to chase down people who are doing things they probably shouldn't.

Jamey: 57:50

That and the fact that you have a GCR with a million different specs I mean yeah that's something like 900 pages if I remember right it's giant. Yeah I mean yeah sporting regs and tech regs for F1 are long but it's still it's it's one series one machine uh yeah GCR having all those different ones yeah that's I mean I'm I'm hats off to guys that do it and love it at the regional level because that's just and like at the club level I mean it's like not uncommon to have your engine taken apart for stuff. I I the fact that at one had to have been seven eight years ago I think at the runoffs they were finding some sort of trickery going on with the engines and didn't they disqualify something like a dozen of the top finishing spec miatas because they had all done some sort of boring that they had to pull the cylinder heads off and I was actually at that one.

Adam: 58:52

I don't remember the all the I do remember I think it was one of the uh approved suppliers engine suppliers I think and don't probably shouldn't say it because I think you know the way they machined it um probably shaved a little bit more off the head which make you know got you slightly more compression. But yeah I think they disqualified I want to say it was down to ninth or tenth place and yeah that sounds right I remember the only reason that person got it was his car wasn't checked because it already got home so he may have had this hey luck of the draw sometimes wow but you know it was kind of funny.

Jamey: 59:27

Yeah so oh go ahead Jamie so a couple of years ago oh last year I guess I uh there was an incident that uh was pretty famous and uh it might have been the sprint race but um at Coda a thing happened and I believe it was Lewis Hamilton that was involved at the end of the race his skid plate was too small that's your team right that has to do those measurements at the end of the Into the race, or how does that kind of thing work? And then, you know, post-race, what's sort of the chain that that would lead to the fans reading about, you know, some sort of change in the order because a technical violation happened?

Adam: 1:00:15

Yeah. So for F1, we don't do the actual measurement. Um, usually we're there more of just chain of custody. So after the race, they come and they and that's pretty that's a pretty common check. I mean all series. We did that in F4 all the time. Um how you check it is different. I actually am jealous of the F1 guys because all they have is they they make the teams pop out these little metal plates that are built into the skid plate, and then they have a little uh micrometer and they just measure how much material is left. And F4, I had to actually jack up the car and then crawl underneath it on my back with a depth gauge and you know, get splinters in my my back of my head all the time. But um yes, what usually it'll happen is they'll come around, they'll pull the skid the skid blocks, they'll do their checks, and then you know, the our guys have to just kind of keep custody of them until everything is is checked and make sure that that that no one is messing with them because they are it's funny because when you're watching them, um you know, one of the jokes is they go in a little bucket and then they go inside a drawer and all of a sudden um nobody knows what happened, all of a sudden they come out and they're legal. You know, no part is supposed to leave the vision of a scrutiny, or so if any part comes off a card, this is all weekend long. So if something comes off a car, you have to keep an eye on it. And if something does happen, you call it in right away. So that that's a big part of it. Um Yeah, we had uh I remember what actually I think it was mental this year at Dakota. Yeah, my my one of my guys was oh my god, I the skate plate's gone. And I run over there and I go, you mean that one over there? And like, oh thank god. So like, no, it didn't go anywhere, it was still in plain sight. He just you just lost track of it for a second. So you know, that's good.

Jessica: 1:01:56

So what would it take to be so for all of our aspiring, you know, marshals or people that want to get into this, what do you look for when you're hiring for these types of events? Like what kind of prerequisite, you know, experience do you have to have or knowledge of cars or whatever? And the reason I ask is because you alluded to it earlier, you know, you guys have the best seat in the house. I have to imagine that there's some that there is some vetting that must be done that you can't just take people you don't know because they might fanboy, fangirl out and go do things you're not supposed to do. So I guess is that what types of things do you look for when you're recruiting?

Adam: 1:02:33

So uh our my general recruitment is one you have to do, you no one goes straight to F1 ever. Like everybody has got to get vetted at either WEC, Formula E, Moto GP. Those are kind of the crucibles for for um you know cutting your teeth. One is ability to focus through the chaos. So people who can and people who can stay incredibly calm and who aren't who aren't overwhelmed by the spectacle of it all, you know, because there are people um you know, I've seen and you know, we've all seen it, you know, some marshals want to live stream from corners, right? Like no, you need to be kind of sort of quiet, reserved, and um, you know, not willing to look past all that and focus through it. And then and then a good attention to detail. You know, the guys that do best are the ones that uh you know write the most almost. So um that way because that's a big part of it, is they need to know you're paying attention, you know, that you're you're watching what's happening and being engaged enough to ask them constant questions so that they they know that okay, yeah, maybe they know you don't know everything about this car because that's impossible, but they know that you're actually on top of them, you know, being big brother. So um it's it's a unique personality. You know, it engineering types usually gravitate for that, but I won't say that those are always the best options because sometimes people who are overly engineering focused get caught up in the weeds. So you know, you need somebody who who can stay calm, who likes to stay focused and isn't there for the show as much as it is they're they're really interested in how these cars work.

Jessica: 1:04:05

So yeah, so you don't have to be an expert in automatically. Do not need to be.

Adam: 1:04:09

I mean, I know you don't. I mean, it is helpful if you can point out what an upright is, uh you know, uh what if you know what a torsion bar is, you know, at least at least you can identify those parts. Yeah. I mean, but it isn't absolutely essential, you know, not not I would I would say it's not.

Jessica: 1:04:26

Yeah. Do you guys hire a lot of um formula SAE students for these types of gigs for WEC and and stuff?

Adam: 1:04:34

For WEC, there's a lot of guys that come from Formula SAE, mainly just because uh it's such an exhausting race. So you need the endurance. So a lot of times you need the younger bodies who can who can stay awake for that long. Um yeah, but um trying to think that's we haven't had as many formula SAE folks in a while. Um, I think Alan did it this year for me. He's he's one of my deputies, Alan Moffitt. So he did he actually took over Wet because I had a a baby uh that that same weekend.

Jessica: 1:05:01

So congrats.

Adam: 1:05:03

He was born on race day, actually. Oh wow, congratulations.

Jessica: 1:05:06

Yeah, yeah. All right, what what's his name?

Adam: 1:05:08

Mateo. Mateo Alexander.

Jessica: 1:05:10

Oh, very cool.

Adam: 1:05:11

Okay, so next generation of scrutineers, assuming assuming the specialty is still alive when he's old enough. So hasn't been replaced by AI. So my speaking of AI, my series thinks I'm talking to it.

Jamey: 1:05:26

So I um I think it's fair at this point to introduce probably the single biggest drawback to joining your team is you guys have a lousy schedule.

Adam: 1:05:39

It depends on the weekend, it depends on the series. Um so usually I'd say yes. A lot of times we have to be there before everybody else, and we get to stay after, but on some days, uh, you know, we get to come in slightly later. So I it all it all depends. Um when we're running a support series, so anytime we have to do F1 with Formula One Academy, then that gets to be a nightmare because then you've got to be in extra early for the F1 Academy guys, and usually we have to all travel together, and then you're staying late till oh dark 30. There's actually been times at Coda where you know we're returning stuff up there to Lot M and Alyssa and all the crew up there have already gone, they're already home. I'm like, hey, where do you want me to leave this? Like everything's locked up and everybody's gone. Right. Um, yeah, but it's it's worth it. This thing is worth it. We get good parking usually.

Jessica: 1:06:27

That's very true. You guys you guys do get paddock parking that nobody else does.

Jamey: 1:06:32

So yeah. Yeah. So tell us about your teams. Who were some of the long time scrutineers and the the memorable scrutineers that you've gotten to work with?

Adam: 1:06:44

So the team um is they're pretty stable. It's it's amazing that people don't give up this specialty quickly or easily. Um, Suzanne Royce was chief scrutineer for 35 years, I think. Um and I'd say on the F1 side, close to half the crew are people that came from from her her days. Um the Nixes, Richard and Claudia has been wife team. They've been doing it, I think I think almost longer than Suzanne was actually chief. Um there's uh Mark Muddyman, Steve Steve, Barb, Barb Avery Winton. There's a bunch of folks that have been doing it almost as long as I've been alive. I shouldn't say that. Uh but we're starting to see some changes, you know, because some people are just getting tired, you know. There is there is a longevity to this because it is long hours of standing and walking around in the sun.

Jamey: 1:07:45

So um but that's pretty neat. I mean, those that kind of longevity is is uh not unknown in our world, you know. There are marshals that you'll hear talking in the tent about you know being a marshal back in the 70s and and all of that. And you know, that that's really cool, but it's a great testament too to the team and you know what they're doing.

Adam: 1:08:08

This group tied for um in the in the last Marshall newsletter at Coda, we had, I think, we tied with uh uh F and C for the most number of people who had worked every single quota F1. So considering the our the size of our crew, that was pretty amazing. So yeah, I think eight eight eight of the crew uh was was um yeah, I think every single F1 is awesome. So actually when I started I thought it was interesting because I learned I when I first got onto the Formula One crew, it was almost a completely different crew from all the other events. Like that it was it was that stark. It's it's changed a bit. It's become there's now a core folks, there's a core group of people who uh kind of do all of them. Yeah.

Jessica: 1:08:55

Have you ever had to uh fire anyone for for maybe being a too much of a super fan or other reasons?

Adam: 1:09:02

I I have had to uh not invite people back for not doing anything. That was that was one like wait, I there's nothing on this paper. This paper should have an entire list of things, and you know, I guess you could call them super fans, you know. They had a good time, they were overexcited by what they saw. They did they their hands stopped working. So um, yeah, so that was I've had that. I don't I'm trying to think that I haven't had to fire any anybody else. I've never had to send anybody home mid mid-weekend.

Jessica: 1:09:36

That's that's really good. That's uh that's a big deal. Yeah, I would assume that yeah, you probably need to at least have sort of a word of mouth like recommendation before you would kind of consider if somebody, even for the the minor leagues, as you if you will, like with WEC and Odo finding the training grant. Yeah.

Adam: 1:09:52

It's actually the the best way to is is I tell people you want to get on in this crew, make friends with the crew. Because if you can fit in with the team, then you have the right mindset. So that's a that's a big part of it, because that that you know, even though I have a whole application waitlist system that I built, you know, I will pull from those recommendations that people bring to me. So that matters, that matters most.

Jamey: 1:10:14

Well, flipping the calendar forward, next year there's gonna be a new F1 car. What kind of impact on your team is a whole new car gonna have?

Adam: 1:10:25

Probably not much. Uh, because the what we do is it's gonna remain the same. You know, even though you have new rules, new regulations, it's just a matter of figuring out okay, where is this part of the car now? Is it at the back or is it at the front?

Jamey: 1:10:39

You know, so is it somewhere in the middle in a place that no one can see?

Adam: 1:10:44

Yeah, yeah. So I mean, I you know, we it almost doesn't matter for us because that's our job is to adapt and figure out what what these things are. So that's I'm I'm actually you know looking forward to seeing the cars be a little smaller because um the they've gotten so big. We don't push them around as much as we used to, but they're not fun to push, they're very heavy and awkward. So I'm looking for we're looking for a slight reduction in size so that when you do have to maneuver them around on those those uh skateboards, it's a little easier. You're not worried about crashing them into something.

Jamey: 1:11:16

So yeah, I just I don't think a lot of people realize just how big a Formula One car actually is when you're standing up close to one.

Adam: 1:11:24

Yeah, or how big they've gotten, I should say.

Jamey: 1:11:26

Right.

Adam: 1:11:27

They weren't that big before.

Jamey: 1:11:28

So yeah, I like it.

Adam: 1:11:31

I won't say they'll be much.

Jamey: 1:11:32

So what's your favorite of all the of all the events you get to do all year, what's your favorite event, the one you look forward to the most?

Adam: 1:11:41

Uh I'm an F1 snob, always have been. Uh even before, long before Drive to Survive. Um, but I will say the my favorite event to work where there's action and I'm doing stuff is is Moto GP. It has become that. Um my favorite event to just be a part of had been for a long time Formula E in Brooklyn, almost more because of the overall atmosphere and stuff around it. Um, but yeah, you just can't you can't beat an F1 event. Like when you're when you're standing out there uh at the end of a race and you're seeing a million people to try to hop over the fence, you're like, yeah, this is this is special. They want to be right where you are. Yeah, that's actually one of my uh go-to lines when somebody is is being a little bit of a pain for whatever reason. I go, you realize I can replace you with any one of those people out there right now. So uh that usually calms things down.

Jessica: 1:12:35

That'll teach them.

Adam: 1:12:36

Yeah. Do you want to come back?

Jessica: 1:12:39

So do you have any like crazy stories you'd be able to share? Any memorable, interesting things that you you're allowed to talk about that have happened at any crazy stories.

Adam: 1:12:50

I'm trying to think. Need need some of my other guys here to to remind me.

Jessica: 1:12:55

Like things that have happened that you busted somebody on, and if you need to redact the team name, you certainly can.

Adam: 1:13:03

Not so much in uh F1. I mean, we you know, a lot of what you find is usually uh a lapse in somebody remembering protocol. You know, that's usually what it comes down to. Like, you know, uh one of the teams is so when they put in a repair request for the FIA, you know, the scrutiner gets the repair request and they have to present the part that's been repaired and the part that you know they took off. And every part on a car has a has a part number. It's just like a real car in real life. And the part numbers didn't match, and we weigh them, and you have to make sure that the weights are correct and stuff, but it was it was off. Um, and so those kind those kinds of things uh happen a fair amount, and it really was like an oversight on the team's part, and and I guess they didn't submit the right paperwork or whatever. So a lot of what you're catching is just uh keeping people in line. Um, I mean, I could talk about Formula Four, that's where we've got some blatant just no holds barred G. You're like, what are you what are you doing?

Jessica: 1:14:02

So people trying to pull a fast one, you know.

Adam: 1:14:07

Oh, that one, I mean, there the one year um we had they would modify the oil pressure sensors so that the oil pressure would read lower when it's running, so that they it would the car they were essentially starving the engine of oil so that um they could produce more power because with when you have that much oil, there's a bit of a drag on it. Needless to say the engine manufacturer's not happy, you know, because it's at least motor. Um, but then they would uh what did they do? They I'm trying to remember, they they starved it through by putting a restrictor on the flow and then they modified the oil pressure sensor so that you wouldn't see the restricted flow. Um it's just like you know, they did like a series of things. You're like, what? What's wrong with you people?

Jamey: 1:14:46

Somewhere some mechanic is making notes right now. Yeah, gonna rewind this episode and go, wait a minute, how did they do that?

Adam: 1:14:55

And that same team uh you know pulled the skid plate off and then they because it wasn't as sophisticated as the ones in F1, and it's essentially a piece of plywood, and they hollowed it out. Like it looked like a termite had just you know eaten out the inside just to try and make the car lighter, and then they put it back in place. You know, what? Yeah, so I mean there's there's you do see teams that do stuff like that. So yeah, um but in F1, not so much.

Jamey: 1:15:21

Anything for an extra mile an hour.

Adam: 1:15:25

One tenth of a and I think that team in F4 did it because their driver was heavy, so they you know wanted to get back to it. I'm like, I'm like, how much wood did you possibly take out? Like, are you kidding? Wow, it's only a you know five eighth inch board to begin with. Like people do amazing things.

Jessica: 1:15:47

Yep, yep. Have you do you have any bucket list races you've ever wanted to work that you haven't yet?

Adam: 1:15:52

Maybe international or oh no, there's a slew of international ones, you know, Spa, Monaco. Mainly I want to work Monaco because they don't have to wear tabards. The scrutineers were like they have to wear suits. Yeah, I'm okay with that though. I I watch I that's actually what I watch most of the F1 for. It's like, what do the scrutineers do there? How do they do things?

Jessica: 1:16:12

Yeah, and what are they wearing? Like in the F1 movie, they were wearing like polo shirt and khakis. And I'm like, that doesn't seem like a scrutineer outfit, but whatever.

Adam: 1:16:20

Yeah. Actually, it was funny at Vegas last year we were uh forget which session it was, but we were sitting there and like somebody noticed we noticed some scrutineers up on the or um they look like corner workers on the wall and they got orange jumpshoots. I'm like, that's odd. You don't normally have them in orange jumpsuits. And I'm like, wait a minute, that tabard's like two years old. I was about to call somebody and somebody said, Oh no, they're filming reshoots for the movie.

Jessica: 1:16:45

That's funny because that was one of my goofs that I noticed. It was like, why is there an orange jumpsuit on Pitland in that movie? And that's and I think their tablet even said track on it. It didn't even say pitland, and there were so many continuity. Oh, that's funny that you noticed that.

Adam: 1:16:58

Oh, yeah. I mean I was literally about to pick up the radio. No, no, they're filming reshoots. I'm like, oh, okay.

Jessica: 1:17:03

Well, they should they should have told us that's a legitimate thing to call in. So have you worked in international races?

Adam: 1:17:11

I have not. Uh-oh. That's that's something we're now that we have three of them in the United States, it's something that I'm like toying with. Like maybe we can get a little exchange program going, you know. So keep one seat open for for somebody overseas or something like that.

Jamey: 1:17:25

Do you have any inner market? Do you have any international scrutineers come in?

Adam: 1:17:30

Uh we do not. I'm trying to think. The only international, I don't know, and he never actually took up the offer. Dennis uh Casteloo, who everybody knows in Bit Lane, like we he was gonna do a couple events with us, but then he didn't. So um, well, uh yeah, Canada's the only one. Ricky Wong worked with us a couple times before he kind of retired. Um trying to think. But yeah, just Canada right now. I know the chief scrutineers for Mexico, not well, well, but um they've worked, they've come to observe when we first got F1 because we had it before they did. And then um uh I don't know the current chief, but the free previous chief for the UK got to know, actually got to know him at Miami this year because he was a guest of ours. So um yeah, so you know, trying to make contacts out throughout the networking, networking.

Jessica: 1:18:18

Well you heard yeah, you heard it here first. If anyone out there is a scrutineer in Monaco, you let us know. We'll put you in contact with Adam.

Adam: 1:18:28

Well, probably couldn't have I couldn't afford one night of the room.

Jessica: 1:18:32

Well they'd probably cover that for you, wouldn't they?

Adam: 1:18:35

I have no idea. Yeah, I don't know. I don't know. I know I know some scrutineers get paid like a stipend or something in some countries.

Jessica: 1:18:42

So I think it's such a high, you know, you guys have to, you know, such a high pressure gig, you would think they'd cover something for that.

Adam: 1:18:49

We get wonderful sandwiches.

Jessica: 1:18:51

There you go. Yes, yes, definitely. Because Jamie, you've hosted some international starters before, right? Haven't you?

Jamey: 1:18:59

Um, yeah, we've had a couple. Uh we had uh the uh JR from um uh Drasil Roberts from Abu Dhabi. He works on the start line in Abu Dhabi. He's uh worked with us at the second Miami race, and yeah, that's uh he got to do his first rolling start with me. He'd never done one before. Like, what is it with? He was pretty hopped up when when it all said and came said and done because uh some adrenaline was coursing through his veins at that point.

Adam: 1:19:34

This the here's an interesting one. Um, it's not something I was a part of uh having make happen, but um one of the scrutineers for Moto GP, Nuria, she was from Spain, she's actually now one of the uh technical staff for the FIA for F1. So that's awesome. Some scrutineers can can make it to that level. So yeah, it's always fun to see her work.

Jessica: 1:19:57

So that's really cool. Yep, you never know, it could lead to something big. We've had lots of uh people on here that have gone on to do super cool things, yourself included. Well, I think we got a good overview of all of this. I certainly learned a lot.

Adam: 1:20:14

I didn't know anything about they get to do what do you think, Jamie?

Jamey: 1:20:23

Great to have you here, Adam. It's been uh really great talking to you. Um I should say that um at the university I was uh used to work at, the uh um we had a a little seminar in F1, and Adam came and spoke to my class and uh was really great talking to them. And I remember that they were all very excited about scrutineering after Adam was done. So uh thank you for doing that. And it's always great to see you.

Adam: 1:20:53

And uh here's a fun fact on the ongoing out if you Google scrutineering, usually uh dance ballroom dancing judging is what comes up first. There you go. There you go.

Jamey: 1:21:05

They're called scrutineers too. I bet there's a few people listening to this who looked at the the title of this podcast and did just that and wondered what the heck are we talking about on this racing show?

Jessica: 1:21:16

Oh, that's funny. Well, you can moonlight us that someday, Adam. If you ever get bored with this, go work on dancing with the stars or something like that. Absolutely. Oh, that's funny. Well, thank you again for your time. This is awesome. We appreciate it. And uh we will probably see you pretty soon in uh Lost Wages.

Adam: 1:21:31

Sounds good. Awesome. Talk to you guys soon. Thanks. All right, thank you.

Jessica: 1:21:36

All right, we'll see ya.

Speaker 3: 1:21:37

Bye.

Jamey: 1:21:41

Adam Gavalla is the uh chief of scrutineering at almost every big event that we have at Coda and uh few that we don't have at Coda, and always great to spend time with him, like I mentioned in the interview. He came and spoke at at uh in my well, he didn't come. We we did it via Zoom, but uh you know he he talked to my class and got them all excited about scrutineering. And I know the effect that that uh him talking about scrutineering has on folks that are interested in doing that. It's really cool. And Adam's one of those really neat people who's just super nice and easy to talk to, but boy, when he's working, he gets in a zone.

Jessica: 1:22:27

He is so laid back, but and with such a high stress job, it's pretty amazing how how calm he always is. But yeah, he's always so nice and what a great guy to have leading that team, you know. Like it's uh yeah, I can't imagine. You know, he uh he did talk about it. Sounds like, you know, what they do in the in the big leagues, if you will, has kind of been diminished over time, which is kind of like the same for start, you know.

Jamey: 1:22:50

We don't wave the sportsman flag anymore, you know. We don't we don't show signs at the at the uh stand anymore for the five-minute board, it's all done with the gantry. You know, it's progress, you know, what do you think?

Jessica: 1:23:04

Taking all of our jobs.

Jamey: 1:23:07

Not all of them. They can't they can't wave the checker flag yet.

Jessica: 1:23:10

It'll be an optimist, one of those optimist robots waving a flag.

Jamey: 1:23:14

Let's not let's let's not give them any ideas.

Jessica: 1:23:18

Yeah, no, it was it was great. It was a great overview. And and I think if anything, I think this was a great recruitment tool for SECA scrutineering. Yeah, it actually is.

Jamey: 1:23:29

You know, and if you're interested in any of the stuff we talk about on this podcast, that's that's the way to get started, is find the STCA chapter region near you, you know, that you live in, and find the people who do what you want to do and ask them when their next event is. And you know, almost always they're very glad to have new people in.

Jessica: 1:23:51

Yeah, that and you know, he talks about it, you know, as we talked about with Tony and Nadja in the last episode, you know, it is a highly vetted team just because of the access you have, especially some scrutineering, even more so because you get to be in the garages. So you definitely do need to have your repres reputation precede you in such that you know, you need to kind of be a person that can be trusted to be around that. So yeah, if scrutineering is something you're interested in, definitely start at the local level. Um, get to know people, get you know, get some references. Uh like you said, it's a lot of word of mouth. I I feel like, you know, Nadja and Tony have I think sent people to them and vice versa and whatever.

Jamey: 1:24:30

And sure. The teams work very closely together.

Jessica: 1:24:33

They do, yeah. So but no, it was it was very interesting to kind of read about that. And uh yeah, I think um I I might have to give it a try one of these days.

Jamey: 1:24:42

You know, you're crazy enough that I bet you would.

Jessica: 1:24:45

I would I I would never want to do it. I would do it, I would want to do it, but like he was saying, you know, they I don't know. I like to do things, I like to be busy. I feel like I could see myself doing it more at the club level just to have something to do. And I did get to learn a little bit about that in a recent um SIT rotation as the tech steward kind of sort of you know, watching them, you know, he talks about how you gotta weigh the car, you gotta move him up, put push him up on the scales and check this and that. And you know, you do learn some interesting stuff about all that, and especially it's so, you know, I don't know, it it's so much more like the Wild West. Well, sure.

Jamey: 1:25:27

Um they gotta test the mule and yeah, and all the subterfuge and espionage, and you know, I I remember Adam telling my students a story. I I meant to ask him about this, but didn't get a chance. But I remember him telling my students that one of the things that he would caution a scrutineer about is if they're really being nice to you and a whole bunch of them come over and start talking to you and they're distracting you from something that they're trying to get away with on the other side of the room, and you better keep your radar going, you know, because if they're too nice to you all of a sudden, yeah, there's something they don't want you to see.

Jessica: 1:26:09

Ah, sleight of hand, all that kind of stuff. Oh man, that's interesting. Yeah, I believe it. Yeah, that's funny. Well, yeah, we'll run into him pretty soon in uh Vegas Grand Prix.

Jamey: 1:26:20

So yeah. Jess, you've got a cool role at the next Vegas Grand Prix.

Jessica: 1:26:26

I I do. I'm gonna be, I think, the deputy chief of start, along with somebody here that might be in the throat.

Jamey: 1:26:34

Two starters. Yes, two starters you're listening to, yeah.

Jessica: 1:26:38

Yes, thank you for the invitation. I um I am not replacing, I'm standing in for Eric.

Jamey: 1:26:43

No, no, no, no, no. Did you want to say why Eric can't so so Eric, my son can't, he was my deputy for US uh Grand Prix in Austin, but uh he's getting married the Saturday before. So and I'm grateful to his wife, soon-to-be wife Ariel, for not choosing the Vegas Grand Prix date for their nuptials. But yeah, so I'm gonna go straight from their wedding in Denver to the event in Vegas. So yeah, that's gonna be interesting. So he'll miss that. Jessica's gonna be the deputy for that weekend. And actually, I'm looking forward to it. You're you're a good starter, you deserve to be there.

Jessica: 1:27:27

Well, thank you. I'm I it was a lot of fun, and I think uh it'll be I don't we haven't really we didn't really talk about Vegas last year because we didn't have this podcast around that.

Jamey: 1:27:36

That's right. We didn't. We we came up with this podcast idea very shortly after Vegas.

Jessica: 1:27:42

I think so. Um, you know, last year Vegas was kind of bittersweet, to be perfectly honest with you. It was um I it was very last minute I was reached out to to uh move change what I I was supposed to be a PPG marshal, and then uh it was one week before I was set to fly out, I got a notification of, hey, we need someone to be the communicator for PPG. Um would you like to do it? It was I was honored to get the you know offer. I was very kind you know for them to think of me, but at the same time, I I was whisked away to a different hotel, away from everyone, and it was it was um kind of race control people don't play with the rest of the team. So and it's no disrespect to the race control. No, not at all. At all. It was just it was um it was bittersweet, it was a very cool opportunity, and it's led to some other things. We kind of talked at the beginning of this, and I got to do the same thing, just USGP and worked with great people, learned a lot, but I uh I hardly got to see any of my pals, you you included. I think we hung out once at the very briefly, and um because everyone else was away, so that's kind of why I feel like I'm getting my mulligan this year of being able to be back outside and kind of get to work with everyone because you know we you know the PPG folks are also family of ours, you know. I think did Adam say that they're cousins or whatever it was.

Jamey: 1:29:02

Yeah, Adam called them both before we started ru uh going, he called them the they were cousins of Nadia, Tony, and Adam were cousins because they all worked together in Pit Lane. I'm kind of offended he didn't include me in that, but that's all right. That's okay.

Jessica: 1:29:18

Yeah, you're maybe a I didn't work with them quite.

Jamey: 1:29:21

I I'm just I'm yeah, I'm like second cousin or or I'm a cousin once removed.

Jessica: 1:29:25

Yeah, there you go. But you know, it is we all are all a family, and so I think just to be out there with you guys, the starters and the PPG, you know, and just getting to see everything. And I I'm one of the weirdos that loves Vegas. I know it's a marmite kind of town, as the Brits would say. You either love it or you hate it. And I'm one of the weirdos that loves Vegas. So to be in race control in Las Vegas, it was interesting because it's you know, that big, beautiful pit building that they built. It is like a bomb shelter. You know, it's no windows, it is very well insulated, you couldn't hear anything, you may as well have been in another country. All this stuff is going on literally right outside the door, and you're so far away from it. So that was another thing. As much as I do enjoy working in race control at these things, like you are not present in that way. You're not out there getting to see all the fanfare and stuff like that. So I'm thrilled. So once again, I appreciate you uh extending the offer. And I hope I don't disappoint. No, you don't try not to drop those flags.

Jamey: 1:30:24

But oh, oh, and and for those of you listening to us prior to the Las Vegas event, look for Jessica and I, because we're gonna be running around with some microphones and doing some stuff that might involve you. So have your stories ready.

Jessica: 1:30:42

There you go.

Jamey: 1:30:43

Tell where your your home track, you need to know it right away. How'd you get started? What's your coolest event? What uh what what's your fondest memory? All kinds of neat little stuff like that. You never know what somebody with a microphone might ask you uh at the Las Vegas Grand Prix. Yeah, at the at the traffic cone convention, I call the Egyptian ballroom of the Luxor Hotel. Everybody's standing around in orange, it's just hilarious. I just I call it a traffic cone convention because that's what it looks like.

Jessica: 1:31:15

Yeah, yeah, it pretty much is. So that's funny. Yeah, I was uh oh yeah, go ahead. Go ahead. I was gonna say I was just in Las Vegas, uh we mentioned earlier for music, and I actually stayed at the Luxor. Uh so I checked it out ahead of time. I was gonna leave like a note and hide it somewhere and see if it would still be there, but I was like, there'll be cameras on me. You know, what the hell exactly anyway?

Jamey: 1:31:38

So speaking of Vegas, you you were something of a Vegas expert for a non-local, you know Vegas pretty well. So for a Marshall who's headed into town for the Vegas Grand Prix, what uh should they know, Jess?

Jessica: 1:31:56

Sure. I so just some context. Um, my family, we go to Vegas for Christmas every year. We've been doing this for like 18 years. We don't do any gifts, there's no shopping. It is, we just meet up in Vegas and we love it because it's just so non-stressful. I feel like Christmas shopping is just like, ah, God, you know, especially in this in this instant gratification Amazon world we live in. Does anyone really need any more stuff? You know, whatever. So we've been doing it for a long time and we love it. And December is a very cheap time to go to Vegas, just saying.

Jamey: 1:32:28

And it's not except when the Grand Prix in town.

Jessica: 1:32:31

Oh yeah. Well, even so, I feel like it's not as bad as it was that inaugural year.

Jamey: 1:32:36

No, that first year was pretty bad, but since then it's tapered off.

Jessica: 1:32:39

Yeah, so we go quite a bit, and uh, we have some, you know, we're not I'm not like at the local level knowing all the off strip places, but you know, yeah, we have some of our faves. But uh yeah, so if you're a newcomer to Vegas or you're you know just wanting to look for stuff to do, there's a lot of really great places. Um I'll I'm gonna be name none of these places.

Jamey: 1:33:00

Name drop to your heart's content.

Jessica: 1:33:02

None of these places are sponsoring us. Uh so this is all just although we'll hit them up when we're there. Maybe we should, yeah. Um, so one that I think if you've marshalled at LVGP before, I bet you, I guarantee you've seen it. And it's um it's Ellis Island, and you'll see it's it's at like turn four. And I I feel like I remember us taking those buses when we were arriving, and I think you drive right by it. But um that place is awesome. It's a it's right off strip. It's like a block behind uh the horseshoe, which was formerly Bally's, and um there it's just very like non-pretentious, like it's not a total to keep this PG crap hole. It's very it's nice, it's very nice, but it's not fancy. It's like normal, down-to-earth, cool people, dealers if you're into gambling, really cheap gambling. Uh they they brew beer there, they've won awards for their brewery. They have uh this awesome 24-hour a day steak special for like 10 bucks that I I will definitely be getting at some point. So maybe we should set up. I'll have to go there.

Jamey: 1:34:05

Maybe maybe we'll do a podcast meetup somewhere. There you go.

Jessica: 1:34:08

Yeah, we'll probably be there at some point, but that's a really great place to go and really cool people. And um, I always love to give them some business because especially during this time of the year, you know, they're kind of in the in the ground zero of all of this, and so their traffic is kind of obscured. And so um definitely give them some love if you have a chance. Um, you won't be disappointed, I think. And they have really good, they have a barbecue there, they have like ribs and stuff. I know all the Texans are gonna be like, eh, it's not like Texas barbecue. It's that's awesome.

Jamey: 1:34:38

Texans will go for the steak.

Jessica: 1:34:40

I don't know where else you can get like a rack of ribs with all of the trimmings for 18 bucks. I mean, it's but anyway, I yeah, we'll definitely we're gonna hit that up at some point. So that's a really cool place. Um, you know, all the uh there's a lot of speakeasies now. Like I feel like you're hearing more than a lot of people.

Jamey: 1:34:57

I was gonna get you to talk about the speakeasies because that's a new thing to me. Yes, and but I had seen them on Instagram before you mentioned them to me, and so that was kind of cool. But yeah, you're right. They're everybody's talking about them now.

Jessica: 1:35:11

They're doing a lot of them, but the one that I really love, and we went there last year, the brief moment I saw you last year in Vegas, um, is even though it's maybe on the little on the loud side, I still think it's very cool. It's the ski lodge, it's a cosmopolitan. Cosmopolitan has a like four or five or maybe six.

Jamey: 1:35:28

Yeah, I I went into two of them. Uh, the first one I went into I recognized and remembered from Instagram, and then I realized the one you were directing me to was a different one. So yeah, I hit two of them just in that. Yeah, that's it.

Jessica: 1:35:42

Did you go to the which one? Did you go to the theory?

Jamey: 1:35:45

The one that's in the food court, yes, the tequila place, yeah.

Jessica: 1:35:49

Yes. So if you go in the food court, there's like a like it looks like a fire escape looking door with like a pinata of a donkey, like a picture on it.

Jamey: 1:35:59

It it's it looks like a maintenance door, like uh, you know, a door you'd find a custodian using.

Jessica: 1:36:04

Yes, and it's tiny. I mean the the occupancy of that space is probably like 20 people.

Jamey: 1:36:10

I think it was 28, something like that.

Jessica: 1:36:12

Very small. That one's pretty cool. I the ski lodge is my fave because it truly looks like you're stepping into like an actual like Apre Ski Lodge. And I think it's kind of an 80s kind of with neon lighting.

Jamey: 1:36:23

I've never seen a ski lodge with neon lighting, but this one does.

Jessica: 1:36:27

It's very cool. And they got these big like LED screens with like to make it look like it's the outside and it's snowing outside. That's a very cool place. It's a mixology place, so the drinks are not the same. They're really good though. They do they really spend a lot of time, you know, they're very craft on that, but that one is pretty cool. Yeah, there's a whole bunch from the in the cosmopolitan, so you can Google that. Um, there's a lot of cool rooftop places. Um, you know, I think a lot of places have now. Alice Island has a new rooftop bar actually that just opened, and I did not have a chance to go when I was.

Jamey: 1:36:59

Oh well, that may be where you find this.

Jessica: 1:37:02

You know, the let's see, Mandalay Bay has a really cool rooftop. It's actually part of the House of Blues. It's called the Foundation Room. So look that one up.

Jamey: 1:37:12

Um, it's if you look It's actually pretty close to the Luxor where the Marshall was going to stay. Yeah, absolutely. Take the little train over there.

Jessica: 1:37:18

Yep, and you can walk very close. But if you if you're looking at Mandalay Bay from the outside and you look at the the words of Mandalay Bay on the very, very top of the building, it's you'll see like a little window next to the M. That is it. And so you are truly at the very, very end of the strip, and the views are spectacular, like looking down upon. And there's really not, it's not overly fancy. I mean, I don't know the week of you know what it's gonna be like, but there was no, there's generally not a cover as far as I know. Um, the W Hotel, which is also connected to Mandalay Bay, they have a uh bar, I believe. I don't know if it's still called this, but it used to be called Skyfall. Same kind of thing. I mean, you are as far south on the strip as you can go, so you're really looking at everything, which is very cool. Uh Brew Dog, um, which is kind of uh they've had some controversy in the past. So you can ask any of our Brits, they'll tell you. But they have a location um on the strip that's actually next to the hard rock and MGM in that area. They have a very cool rooftop space though. Um, it's huge, and it's got like uh an outdoor area with like those heaters and stuff like that. So even this time of year, it's good to that's a cool one. Um downtown. Some people like the old downtown stuff. I don't know. It's a cheaper generally.

Jamey: 1:38:33

A little harder to get to, you gotta take a new one.

Jessica: 1:38:35

A little harder to get to. Um, there's a really cool place. It's been open for I want to say like about five years now. It's called Circa. And it's like this big, beautiful strip caliber resort plopped right in the middle of the old downtown, low ceiling, smoky type places. And it's really kind of been known to revitalize the downtown area because of how nice it is. And they're really sports-centric, so they have this thing called Stadium Swim, and it's literally like an IMAX-sized giant screen on their roof with a pool. So you can sit in the pool and watch sports. Yes. And then their sports boat, yeah, big into sports there. So if that's your thing, that's a good one to go to.

Jamey: 1:39:15

But we're not that far from the hockey arena where the uh Vegas uh Golden Knights play.

Jessica: 1:39:22

Yeah, yeah. Those are fun games if you get the chance. We went to one last year when we went for our Christmas trip.

Jamey: 1:39:27

Yeah, I think you'd have to stay after or come early because they plan their date so as to not be anywhere near Vegas when the Grand Prix in town.

Jessica: 1:39:39

I don't blame them for that.

Jamey: 1:39:40

Yeah, but uh yeah, it's just logistics, you know, that because they're gonna account for so many hotel rooms and this and that. And you know, but last year the was it the football team that had a game on the Sunday down the day after. So, you know, that it's gonna happen. You know, if you wanted to watch a football game, you know, what have you, it it's around.

Jessica: 1:40:05

Yeah, definitely. I mean, we could go on. I don't I feel like I'm talking way too much, but if you ever if you if you have my contact info and you want any more Vegas places, please reach out. I'm happy to share any of the other ones. But I would say one last thing when I was just there. Um, so anyone that's worked Miami and has transited from the Marsha Hotel to the track, you've probably seen the big guitar-shaped hotel, which is one of the hard rocks. Um, they have started construction on the Vegas version of that, and it's and it's going to be massive. And it's at the old Mirage, it's where the volcano was. And I when I was just there, I walked up to it, and they're not wasting any time. I mean, the bottom of the guitar is there's no doubt in your mind that that's what it is, and it's going to be massive. And so, um, so any of those PPG people that always text me pictures of that, you better do that in Vegas when you when you see it. Especially when it's done, you know. So I think it's gonna be massive.

Jamey: 1:41:03

You know, we we we joke about getting sponsors to this program. It better be hard rock. Hard rock better be our first one.

Jessica: 1:41:11

I you know, I've been to 109 of them. I think they owe me something.

Jamey: 1:41:14

So I might have to uh some bone hard rock.

Jessica: 1:41:17

I might have to have a word, yeah. So anyway, but uh yeah, no, I look forward to it though. Uh always a fan. Like I said, Vegas, you love it or you hate it, and uh, we've had a lot of really good times there. And so, oh, one last thing I would love to say. It's a public service announcement. Um, you know, we love going to Vegas for this event. Um, we are guests in their town. You know, most people that work in Vegas, I think it's pretty common that they they work in the industry. And um there's no denying that they're really hit hard by this event. Just, you know, with the the build-out and the disruption it causes them with their own.

Jamey: 1:41:53

Their traffic chaos is just unbelievable.

Jessica: 1:41:56

And just their lack of business in some of the areas that are, you know, kind of blocked that are hard to get to. So all I'm gonna say is that anyone going, whether you're working or you're just attending or whatever, uh, please be kind to any workers you see at any of the you know, hospitality, you know, dealers or bartenders, waiter, whatever. Uh, you know, they're they've dealt with a lot with this, especially every year around this time. And so um, please be kind, tip big if you can. They would really appreciate it and it it would mean a lot to them just because they do get hit by this. So we are guests and just always want to say that because it's my second home. So I want to give them a shout out. So I hope it's uh I hope it's getting better for the local community out there.

Jamey: 1:42:41

Well said, well said.

Jessica: 1:42:42

So anyway, yeah. Well, I look forward to it and look forward to hopefully talking to some people doing some interviews while we're absolutely, yeah, and talking with folks about the podcast.

Jamey: 1:42:52

It's always uh fun to get feedback from folks. And most of the feedback we're getting so far is you've got a podcast. No, absolutely. Check us out and uh look for us at the Vegas. If we uh find you, we may stick a microphone in your in your face and ask you some questions. So, in any case, uh lots of uh episodes coming your way too as we wind up the year. Most of the tracks around this uh the country are kind of closing down for the year, but uh we're still rolling down here in Austin and uh always glad to do that. But uh yeah, so uh if you're not at a track anymore because the weather's changing, catch up on the podcast, and we'll uh hope to see you in Vegas or at another event down the road.

Jessica: 1:43:44

Yeah, sounds good. Well, thanks. It's been a good one. I look forward to the next.

Jamey: 1:43:49

You betcha. And as uh as always, I'm Jamie Osborne and uh joined by Jessica Altoff. Always glad to have you listening to another episode of Track Side the Podcaster Marshalls as we wind up getting close to winding up our first year of the podcast. It's always fun to do, and uh we hope that we'll see you at a track someday soon. Come up and say hi if you do see us, and want to let you know that this podcast is copyright of its owners and creators. Though Jessica and I are employed by Circuit of the Americas, nothing we say represents an official opinion or endorsement from the circuit or any of their clients or series that we might mention. All opinions are our own. Well, Jess, it's been fun as always. We will uh see you at the next one.

Jessica: 1:44:41

Sounds good. We'll see you then.